80 responses to “Screw the premium theme market.”

  1. Daisy Olsen

    Can’t wait to see what you have in store. I have purchased themes and I ALWAYS have to fix them in one way or another. It shouldn’t have to be that way, and there are a growing number of free premium themes that may still have issues but at least there is no money involved so the frustration of fixing problems is much less.

  2. chris

    I support your movement.

  3. Andrew Bergeron

    Cheers Justin! I support your statements about selling these “premium” themes. Most business should hire a web designer to pick a theme and pay them to tweek it. Adding a middle-person is BS in my opinion. Option theme revision looks great. Keep up the good work.

  4. Matt

    You provide remarkably better themes and a million times better support than any premium theme/author I’ve ever known. So I’m with you.

  5. Chuck Reynolds

    Hey man I can’t wait for Project M and thanks for sticking with the community. You build great stuff.

  6. John Scott

    I totally agree that there are a lot of “crap” themes out there that should never be paid for, but I also agree that there are some genuine “top shelf” themes that are worth paying for, such as Brian Gardner’s Revolution theme.

    Plus I would be more than happy to pay for your themes, as they are certainly far superior to the general run of the mill stuff out there!

  7. Remkus

    I agree with John all the way. There are a couple of designers out there that actually know what they are doing. Some charge money for their themes, some don’t. I would have no problem paying for your themes since indeed I do consider them premium in every sense of the word.

  8. Steve Perry

    Your free themes are better than more premium theme.

    Hold on

  9. cellobella

    I always used free themes until I was lucky enough to win one of Brian Gardner’s premium themes – Rev Pro Media. In fact I was using one of his free ones before that.

    I have found Brian to be very helpful on his forums and his themes are excellent. His themes “bring it” for me and I feel privileged to have the opportunity I’ve had to use it.

    I use Options for my son’s site and it is superb.

    Of course, if you pay for a theme you do have higher expectations of customer service.

    Personally I don’t think some of these other pay-for themes (I won’t call them premium) realise that.

    Well done.
    CB

  10. JamesSpratt

    Go Justin. Totally agree with what you’re saying here.

    I’m just beginning to use Joomla as a CMS for non-blogging web work and this is the state that WP would descend into without thinking about it, like you and many real WP users are.

    There are virtually no decent free themes for Joomla out there (that I can find so far), try searching for Joomla themes and it’s all about the money. Not cool. And this is where WP would be in a while if we’re not careful.

    Looking forward to Project M. Keep up the good work and I hope Korea is keeping you entertained.

    James

  11. Ian Stewart

    Now I’m really curious about what Project M will be.

  12. WordPress Modder

    I’m so curious I am about project M, I can hardly contain myself!

  13. BoltClock

    I never really understood the idea behind pay-for-use WordPress themes. And the word premium has also had me badly confused.

    But it’s good to know Project M will be a totally free-for-use project.

    IMHO, you are the real definition of premium WordPress theme designer ;)

  14. RebeccaJ

    I’m looking forward to seeing what Project M is.
    There’s quite a bit of anticipation building for that!

    I found your post to be an interesting read.
    I believe that the consumer who is purchasing the junk theme is doing the WP community a disservice also.
    They buy the theme and then blame Wordpress, their webhost or a handful of other people for the issues they encounter.
    Just because the product has a price tag on it does not mean that it’s worth it!

  15. Ptah Dunbar

    I knew this was going to happen. People using the word “premium” for not-so-premium themes. I wouldn’t even call them themes because their so bad.

    Glad I’m not the only one with plans to innovate in the free themes market.

  16. EdWestin

    You are so right on.

    On a similar note, whenever I go to stadiums for concerts or sports and they charge 7 dollars for crap beer like Bud or Coors, they always have the “Premium Beer” option, which is like 2 dollars more for Corona or Heineken. Premium?! I think what they are trying to say is “slightly less crappy”.

    Also, I think I know what Project M is, and all I’m going to say about it is: I’m really excited!

  17. J Mehmett

    Justin, I’m really very keen on waiting that mentioned Project M.

    For the premium themes market, I’ve only seen three genuine designs, Revolution Themes, Small Potato’s Portolio and iThemes, though I didn’t pay iThemes.

    BTW, please kill Premium Themes, as most of them are crap. Options and Structure were worth to pay for.

  18. StefanJ

    I think your post is quite interesting, and I also share your sceptisism. I think many people live by the idea that Premium-products can make you rich like …. and ensure wealth and happiness for a lifetime, or more. But, very few do invent things like Skype or Google.

    My opinion is that really good shareware, themes or whatever can be worth a lot for the user, and as a consequence, can be paid for. Those making sharewares for a living also need to charge for their products, as any other enterprise.

    On the other side – there are many people (I believe you belong to this group) who do things for others because they enjoy the work, do not really need it for their living/salary, and most importantly, have a feeling that sharing a product/service has a bigger meaning, making the world a little bit better.

    Justin, keep up the good spirit, but don’t work too hard. And drop me a line if you need free advice from a neonatologist :)

  19. MhawSayar

    Dear Justin,

    Whatever they said, whenever you hard, I always believe and support your aim and works. And let me say something, do what you believe!

    I love WordPress Community too!
    Cheers! :)

  20. Project M

    [...] in — is that I want to provide an alternative to the premium theme market I mentioned in the last post with quality themes and [...]

  21. Techie ZOne

    I hv been a victim of this.
    I bought Wp-Pemium theme some time back ( before option) came out. And severly screwed up by the developer. I hv not yet used the theme in any of my project. The guy mentioned something abt the theme and he has something available in it. Tht’s the useless theme I hv ever seen.
    Much to my surprise when i asked for help he told me that he has lots of work n he cant help me in customizing it. If any one wish to buy Wp-Premium theem never ever buy that.

  22. Techie ZOne

    Please excuse me the theme is not Wp-Premium but wp-Remix theme.

  23. Ely

    Love you for those Free themes! Go Project M!

  24. A Marvelous Project and A $500 Design Contest

    [...] features and found many were PAY FOR USE. Naturally, I preferred the free version. Justin has a big rant on the paid themes market. I somewhat agree with his [...]

  25. What Do You Think of Premium WordPress Themes?

    [...] against the premium themes market as a whole is Justin Tadlock, who recently wrote a post titled Screw the WordPress Themes Market.  Justin is someone that I’ve been following for quite awhile now and have a huge respect [...]

  26. What Do You Think of Premium WordPress Themes? | [Blog Tutorials]

    [...] against the premium themes market as a whole is Justin Tadlock, who recently wrote a post titled Screw the WordPress Themes Market. Justin is someone that I’ve been following for quite awhile now and have a huge respect for his [...]

  27. Dave

    I have to say that I have no real problem with someone trying to make money from his labor.

    Justin’s complaint is legitimate — crap is being sold at the same price as excellence.

    But I think that what he identifies is not the need for people to stop trying to sell crap, but for someone in the community to take up the job of ‘trusted guide’, reviewing themes the way CNet reviews digital cameras.

    With a set of standards in place, a review community could dispose of the substandard work simply by telling the truth.

    I have to say that as a developer of very, very modest skills, access to the best work has made my job easier. I paid for one of the Revolution themes and it was the best money I’ve ever spent. It saved me literally weeks of work. (In fact, you can argue that the best “premium” themes are undervalued, when measured against avoided cost.)

  28. Dave

    A couple of missing thoughts from the above post:

    I’m not opposed to free themes. Who could possible be? What one gives to the community is one’s own choice and Justin’s to be applauded and supported in some other way for his decision.

    Another way in which the community could support those looking to create premium themes is to allow a would-be theme developer to submit his/her pre-release theme for quickie analysis — sort of a pre-review. Poor themes could get better, the community’s coding skills are enhanced, and a would-be developer has a sense of how his/her theme would do in the marketplace, whether free or paid.

  29. Hoodgrown Magazine

    When I saw the title of this article I was all set to argue the point with you until I actually read what you wrote. I currently use Mimbo (free) for my site and I’m thinking of either redesigning utilizing Options or doing my next site with Options.

    It’s such a damn good theme.

  30. trendminers

    If I had found your themes a little earlier, I wouldn’t have bought the theme I’m using now. because your themes rock Justin.

    I didn’t give much thought to the purchase, just found a nice theme i needed to have :-) Later on I discovered there was an ongoing discussion about the payable themes. Alas my purchase was completed, and I’m happy with the theme, but if I had to choose today your themes would win…

  31. gofree

    Well said, I planned to get one premium theme, too but I experienced the lack of support from the author during the customization talk till I happened to know Option; and there I stopped and said “YOU GUY ROCKS!”

    Thank you Justin.

  32. cK !

    Mr. Tadlock, your themes are TOP NOTCH and your efforts are quite refreshing!

    With that said, I blame you for my discontent toward the Premium News Themes by Adii. I plunked down a whole Benji for Fresh News and I expected a more versatile theme with numerous options… like your Options theme.

    Needless to say, I was quite disappointed. Now, I’m down $100 and I’m stuck with a theme that is useless for me. I would have much rather donated the hundo to you for your generosity to the WordPress community.

  33. Owen

    Great post .. you can actually feel the emotion in your words.

    I’m a plugin author and most of what I do is available to anyone who wants to use it. I even provide free support where I can (I say most because I have one plugin that has a paid-for-version, but that’s because it’s special and took months in the making)

    As you say, Wordpress was built around the idea of community and there’s a great community out there. But there are also those that try to take advantage of people where they can. As you say, someone of the stuff out there is REALLY poor quality and gives everyone else a bad name. And when someone is forced to pay for it, well, that just takes the biscuit.

    Thanks for the show of spirit. I’m subscribing to the blog and looking forward to hearing more from you !

  34. Blog Bloke

    Hi Justin. You are breath of fresh air amongst all of the hucksters out there. I’m in complete agreement with you and kudos to you for standing by your principles.

    I’m having the same problem with my niche that I created. There are now so many con-artists out there trying spin a fast buck out the pockets of the gullible that it just sickens me.

    The blogosphere was built on the principal of sharing and helpfulness towards are fellow bloggers. Wordpress was born out of that conviction.

    But today we find everything from the corner racketeer to mega corporations trying to exploit our beloved blogosphere. Stick to your convictions and set an example.

    I tip my hat off to you.

  35. Screw the Blog Hustlers: Introducing The Blog Parasite Hall of Shame | Blog Tips Tools and Views by Blog Bloke

    [...] post title was “Screw the premium theme market” where he criticises blog designers who charge for their so-called [...]

  36. John

    I support what you are going to do. I think its the best for wordpress community, to have a great theme with no cost.

  37. Christopher

    Great Post,

    We recently purchased a premium theme because of time constraints. Funny thing is the author promised lifetime support.

    What we got in the way of support was 1 word answers and almost a feeling of “don’t bother me please” when asking questions.

    The very last time we buy anything for wordpress. Bring on Project M!

    Good luck.

  38. Epat

    i’m agree with you, wordpress is a free!

  39. Galwin

    Though you may consider me as one of the lurkers who just wait for the time to reap the fruits of your labor (themes) and use it, I agree that people with no decent ability and dedication should not sell pay-to-use themes. For those who can, I commend them, I commend you.

    I use Options and Structures theme, and I am impressed that you offer them for free yet the quality of those two are way beyond that of numerous pay-to-use themes.

    I totally support you and on your project M. Blessings!

  40. Free themes versus premium themes — WP Project

    [...] say, “screw the premium theme market“, some think simple designs are still the best, others keep on doing what they’ve been [...]

  41. zawadi

    I have been looking for a Theme for a Week that doesn’t suck. Most of the Free themes are made with unfinished and not working parts and also the designers affiliate casino links at the bottom.

  42. Talking to WP Theme Developer Justin Tadlock « Web and New Media
  43. kelly

    I used to think the way you do. As WP versions get better and more ’state-of-the-art”, more free themes will simply stop working (or at the best they malfunction) with the latest/current version. Time and effort is needed to keep themes working and that’s what make theme premium or “pay-to-use” (as you mentioned)…or rather ‘pay-to-own-on-one-domain’ depending on license bought.

    On top of that, many site owners (probably 8% of the market or more) are not prepared to be mistaken for another blog with the same look, and that means hundreds of blog owners.

    There’s really no worry, pay-to-use themes now have much much more customisation feature. A very good free premium theme with customisation options (more than 2,000) is the Ikarus theme (google for it – you’ll find it in several places!) The Ikarus theme took its maker 3 months to create/modify and improve. I dare say not many theme makers who make free wordpress themes are going to spend months on making ONE free theme!

    Pay-to-use or premium has its value and I think they’re gonna stick around longer, for as long as there’s demand for it.

  44. David Coveney

    Hi Justin – I’m very late to this post, even though I’ve always followed your work with interest and admiration. But months later this is still a fascinating post, and I thought it was time to pipe up.

    Of course, lots of people are offering to sell themes – some of which are of dubious quality and with almost zero support. Heck, we even decided recently to enter the field ourselves after a long period mostly specialising in building exclusive themes for businesses and agencies… but what we learned is that building really good, stable and flexible themes that extend on WP functionality is a trick in itself.

    We’re often paid to customise other firm’s premium themes and we can confirm that a lot are flakey as hell. They break easily, use odd php code, and don’t really make the end user’s life an easy one.

    But the real question is: Is there money to be made from hard work with WordPress? The answer is yes, of course. Automattic are doing so (with no significant rewards fed back to contributors to the project), as are many others. And it’s only fair that money can be made. We code because we enjoy it, but code is hard to do, and expensive to produce. We all contribute to the scene (about half our themes are GPL’d) and we hope to get something back.

    And this brings up the next question – should all our themes be GPL? Well, we’ve discussed it, and we’ve decided that no, they shouldn’t. We haven’t made much charging for membership yet (it’s early days really) – but given I was writing shareware and freeware in the eighties and nineties I have experience of how many people will use you software compared to how many people will pay for it. And being British I’ve been brought up with an innate distaste for finding through advertising revenue. So we’re left with needing to give people reasons for joining – the first is exclusives – a lot of our work is GPL only, but member only for the first 2-3 months, and then the non-GPL stuff comes with some clever trickery on top.

    There’s also the big big risk of monetising GPL work – someone less scrupulous could download all your work, and start their own themes club with it as the basis of what you’ve done. It would cost them a lot less than it did you, and if they did it right, few people would even realise they were paying the wrong person. They may not be happy, but the unscrupulous wouldn’t care. I think as the market grows this is likely to become a very real problem. I’ve already noticed how cheerfully people rip off content from my blog :-(

    I’m interested to see how Theme Hybrid turns out for you. These are interesting times we live in and I wish you the best of luck with it :-) I know just how hard it can be to build up something like this.

    Dave

  45. Fabio

    Well, I just want to say this: I love your theme and the “flavors” you posted, really useful, really cool. This being said, what you are doing is exactly the same a lot of premium themes designers are doing: provide a great free premium design and then: “if you want support, you gotta pay”, trying to catter the newbies out there. Don’t get me wrong, it’s deserved and I always thought people has to be paid for their work, I just find the post slightly… I don’t know, I don’t want to use the word “hypocrite”, but it’s the one that’s closer to what it looks. Since my English is pretty crappy, will try to re-word myself: there’s nothing wrong in making money from your hard work. It just sounds bad to criticize someone else for doing exactly the same you’re doing

  46. Automattic removes 200 GPL-licensed WordPress themes

    [...] think most of you already know my thoughts on premium themes. I’m not going to rehash that [...]

  47. Lee

    Hi Justin,

    I am absolutely amazed at the quality of your work. I have downloaded and tested no less than 40 wordpress themes including all of the revolution themes. Your work is absolutely incredible.

    Will be keeping up with you!

  48. Jason

    Amazing Work Justin, even though im a great fan of Brian’s[ revolution] themes. But yes i do support your movement, because somehow these premium themes are hurting the wordpress community, and i agree with that.

  49. Helen Cebis

    Word up Justin you speak the truth.

    There is enough ‘free’ garbage out there without us having to pay for more ‘premium’ garbage.

  50. jeff

    Thumbs Up Dude!!
    Man, I really appreciate your work and what you have done for the wp community..
    Will look forward to all your future endeavors..

    P.S – And I totally agree with you man – screw premium themes!

  51. What Do You Think of Premium WordPress Themes?

    [...] against the premium themes market as a whole is Justin Tadlock, who recently wrote a post titled Screw the WordPress Themes Market. Justin is someone that I’ve been following for quite awhile now and have a huge respect for [...]

  52. kazouar

    This post and all the comments is more like shepherd – sheeps relationship. I can agree with the fact that there’s too many fake Premium themes available for sale. And so is with tons and tons of other goods – tangible or intangible. Once you buy a piece of shit – no chance to do it again, right? And so is with bad Premium themes. For Christ sake, this is how entire market works like!!!
    So what if WordPress has been developed by community willing to share their knowledge freely. Nobody has forced these people to work for free. The same goes for WordPress developers. Why is so bad to sell WP themes and make a few bux for living? Why is that supposed to be so bad if one decided to charge for all the efforts and sweat invested into some theme? Not even prisoners work their asses off for free.
    Justin, I wish you all the best with your project. You make nice and useful stuff, you write good articles but this one sux.
    PS
    Check your site/theme, HTML Tidy throws few errors not worth of your reputation.

  53. kazouar

    Actually I did understand very well this pathetic article and I read the most of all articles you wrote here, I was your fan mate. Obviously your ego doesn’t allow critics so phrases like ‘Screw you too’ are acceptable. However, I’m not about to get so low and reply on that.

    Beside, what else is project M than sucking money out of user’s wallet? Yes, it’s free but for a small annual fee of $20 – if one is expecting support. Stand behind your words mate and make it FREE if you can. Only fools work for free.

  54. Aneslin

    can always support,
    and waiting for Project M
    Good Luck

  55. Lance

    I support your opinion just as I continually support open source for everything. I have always perceived Internet as a free and useful tool for humanity.
    Thanks! :”)

  56. Albert K.

    I used to work with WP themes and I agree with you. the premium market is not that much big a deal, I’d rather stick to “common” WP themes, it is way more profitable for me, by thr way

  57. rsibaja

    I’m agreed with you!

  58. Dez Futak

    I’ve kinda rotated 540 degrees on this one!

    I’ve always been a let’s-share-and-it-keep-it-free kinda bloke, and occasionally ventured into using paid solutions for web design (paid Joomla plugins for example, when the free versions just didn’t cut it)….but I’ve always come back to using free stuff wherever I can (360 degrees so far!).

    But then I came across the Thesis Theme for Wordpress. And no, it’s not because of the affiliate scheme that’s in place to spread it virally (see – no affiliate link here!!)…but that did help me be motivated to spend the money on the developer’s version.

    No, what *really* ’sold’ me (literally) on Thesis was that it *finally* has the web-based design features that make it incredibly flexible, and what’s more VERY useable.

    What I mean by this, is the sheer simplicity with which changes can be made to the design without hacking PHP code.

    I’ve done a fair amount of php coding in the last few years for a telescope project that I run at my school (do a Wikipedia search on: Project Galileo if you’re interested…or a Google search for that matter).

    So why do I shy away from make customized changes to my Wordpress blog by rolling my sleeves up & getting down ‘n’ dirty with the PHP???

    The simple answer is: TIME.

    Thesis saves me bucket-loads of time because of the way it separates the design layer from the features layer.

    OK, so Wordpress, it could be argued does the very same thing..so why *pay* for a theme, when you can mod it for free?

    Well, as I say…TIME…is the issue…I’ve got time to ‘waste’ by posting comments like this on other people’s blogs, instead of debugging php code that I’ve screwed up.

    So, that makes up the other 180 degrees.

    I’m with Thesis – a true Theme Framework.

    And I didn’t get paid to write this either (really!!).

    Cheers,

    Dez Futak.

  59. Paul Littlebury

    You have a good philosophy! Been suckered for themes before – sometimes they are worth it, but largely the themes are either incomplete, have little help advice, incompatible or very invalid code! These people are essentially selling templates, not complete design solutions – they ALWAYS need extra work. When there are quality theme frameworks such as Hybrid around, premium themes especially seem a little pointless now.

  60. CG

    Brian Gardner and Jason Schuller also have what most other designers don’t have… excellent customer focussed support… they know the value in not losing a customer.

  61. John in Waukesha

    For the 15 years I’ve been a consultant, there’s always been overpriced IT services whose results are mediocre at best. To name a few…

    - Lotus Notes Developers when collaboration tools were all the rage
    - Y2K remediation coders when the world was about to fall apart
    - HTML drag-and-drop designers who were considered “coders” back in the day

    I know plenty of people on a personal level who jumped on these bandwagons and fizzled out after a couple of years because their coding stunk and their hype stunk even worse. Those who overpromise and underdeliver are rooted out sooner or later.

    It’s been over a year since this post… do you feel differently about the state of the premium theme market? It sure doesn’t seem to be fizzling out.

  62. Lynne

    I came into the WordPress Community quite by chance…and have to admit it was a scary place to begin with. I came from a very non open source community, and still thrive there I should add. But WordPress has afforded me the opportunity to expand my business and I am grateful for it.

    That said…

    I have begun offering Child Themes for the Hybrid Framework…at a cost. So far I have received some great response on the themes…and added to the mix…some real criticism. One went so far as to tell me that I was not welcome in the community if I was going to charge for a simple child theme.

    I had avoided the open source community for a long time…long before wordpress I charged for service and development on a couple of other “Free” products…and I often was criticized for “Making Money”. Comments such as “How can you charge for this…the software is free?” My response has always been…and remains…”But my time is not free…”

    I am in business to make money…plain and simple…I offer service, selection and second to none support on all my products and services. Sorry, not going for selfless self promotion here…just stating a fact. My services and themes are not free…but my support is…I have never charged for a minute of support…ever. Even back in the day when long distance was not free…I called and supported my clients on my dime…

    Sorry I am rambling…I just get angry…not with you Justin…but with the others that take the time to email and tell me that I am some sort of carpetbagger making money off your back. grrr…going to stop being an angry designer now…lol.

    I love your theme Justin…without Hybrid, I would not be in business…I truly believe that. I made one mistake in the early days developing a site for a client and using a non child theme based “Premium” theme…I spent hours designing a new layout, and style sheet…then an upgrade to WordPress…and an upgrade to the “Premium” theme…and all my hard work was gone in a click of the mouse…thank god for backups…but it cost me and my client valuable time. I have never made that mistake again…Child Themes are the future of Wordpress…and I hope in a small way I can help move it forward with my Child themes…even if they are not free…

  63. Apex

    You don’t need to pay for a premium theme. A very professional and customizable theme is Atahualpa by BytesForAll. It’s by far the most user friendly and customizable theme I’ve encountered in WordPress. You don’t need to know css or php to create a very customized theme from it, he’s made a solid interface to make it easy.

  64. Installing a magazine style theme on my Wordpress blog | The Imagined Universe

    [...] loved was Hybrid News.  It is a free theme, and its developer Justin Tadlock even had a long rant about premium Wordpress themes and how he would not be entering the pay-for-use theme market. I downloaded and installed Hybrid [...]

  65. Party crasher

    Comment deleted for wasting Justin’s time, energy, and database space.

  66. Settling isn’t living… | Dave Thackeray

    [...] I should have lis­tened to Justin Tad­lock. [...]

  67. Atahualpa Theme – Pixel Perfection, No Inca Required | Website In A Weekend

    [...] I’ve spent the past few weeks observing with great interest the raging debate over the merit of premium themes for WordPress. I think it was Justin Tadlock who ignited the urns of oil tipped over the growing band of cats creaming spoils from the WordPress mothership. [...]

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